PMC QA Meeting 20100407
Date: 2010-04-07
Time: 8AM GMT
Venue: irc #adempiere-team
Support Spreadsheet: Adempiere PMC QA
Chat times in GMT-5
(03:00:42) Chakj [~Chakj@125.24.235.174.adsl.dynamic.totbb.net] entered the channel.
(03:01:15) Nui [~Nui@125.24.235.174.adsl.dynamic.totbb.net] entered the channel.
(03:02:17) red1: hi ISEC :D
(03:02:32) CarlosRuiz: interopen: AYT?
(03:02:40) Nithiyada: hi all, I'm nithi from ISEC
(03:02:42) red1: hi CarlosRuiz and others allow me to introduce the new team
(03:02:49) interopen: Hola Carlos
(03:02:56) red1: thats Nithiyada .. she is the PM of ISEC project
(03:03:18) Nui: hi all
(03:03:27) Nui: I'm Chalintra from ISEC
(03:03:34) Chakj: hello
(03:03:47) CarlosRuiz: Hi guys, glad to have you here
(03:03:51) red1: their team of Chakj Nui and i-zugizo are focusing on a project for an end user and have detailed a study on AD performance
(03:04:18) red1: i-zugizo is the java guy and me resolving the priority 9 bugs to them
(03:04:30) interopen: Sawadee ISEC team
(03:04:33) red1: ISEC agreed to contribute all findings to the project in documented form
(03:04:50) red1: interopen is from Spain but in China !
(03:04:53) red1: am i rite?
(03:05:26) Nithiyada: sawadee to all
(03:05:40) i-zugizo: :D
(03:05:57) red1: ISEC, have u got the email about past meetings i sent u?
(03:06:01) CarlosRuiz: yes - interopen is Ivan Calderon - the real hero behind the QA team - lot of work contributed in wiki and configuring CI servers
(03:06:03) red1: u can refer to that to get some perspective
(03:06:12) interopen: yes, from spain but work in china for some years
(03:06:33) Nithiyada: yes, we read some in wiki
(03:06:35) red1: well.. we are all here to assist u (or understand the challenge first) then! interopen
(03:06:52) interopen: ok, we can start then:
(03:07:00) Nithiyada: ok
(03:07:04) red1: its unearthly hour for CarlosRuiz (must be 3am morning his time)
(03:07:23) red1: go ahead interopen or CarlosRuiz
(03:07:30) interopen: 1. We have finally some Sahi POC fully working
(03:08:10) interopen: 2. We will follow with what to use the testing tools we have working junit, fitnesse, sahi for
(03:08:36) interopen: 3. register adempiereqa.com to implement the public CI testing server
(03:08:51) interopen: 4. Security group start?
(03:09:02) interopen: 5. review task list i rearrange
(03:10:08) i-zugizo: which task list?
(03:10:26) CarlosRuiz: http://spreadsheets.google.com/pub?key=tRSJaGZhYpisWq99i-uMYxQ&output=html
(03:10:28) interopen: http://spreadsheets.google.com/ccc?key=0AhBAFce33rWhdFJTSmFHWmhZcGlzV3E5OWktdU1ZeFE&hl=en
(03:11:25) interopen: ok we start with 1 as we have a great achievement having Sahi POC fully working thanks to the help of Sahi developers
(03:11:41) i-zugizo: i can't access last document
(03:12:19) CarlosRuiz: first link is the same document read-only version
(03:12:55) red1: yes they re same
(03:13:49) CarlosRuiz: sahi looks very promising
(03:13:52) red1: interopen: how can others help? I am thinking of preparing JUnit tests that are more elaborate with the Thai team
(03:13:55) interopen: This Sahi POC allow us to make test using the webui with a test recorder and later run them with hudson in CI
(03:14:14) red1: i see.. its more automatic for repeat testing then
(03:14:39) satyag_away ahora se llama satyag
(03:14:42) interopen: 2. We will publish today-tomorrow in ADwiki a table that compares Junit, fitnesse and sahi testing
(03:14:58) interopen: that includes what is the focus of each, usebase,etc...
(03:15:18) interopen: to repeat and to create them, really easy
(03:15:22) red1: The ISEC Team has a java outsource team that i have asked about preparing JUnit tests for logic in AD and they agreed.. but they still warming up
(03:15:28) interopen: :red1
(03:15:34) CarlosRuiz: interopen: is there a way the script recorder to use name of components instead of position?
(03:16:29) interopen: Carlos: yes, we have work with it as we had issues with menu
(03:17:05) interopen: but there are still issues with the image buttons
(03:17:25) interopen: as save, print,etc...
(03:18:05) CarlosRuiz: ok - for zkwebui component naming there is one pending tracker:
(03:18:05) CarlosRuiz: https://sourceforge.net/tracker/index.php?func=detail&aid=2848787&group_id=176962&atid=955896
(03:18:05) CarlosRuiz: https://sourceforge.net/projects/adempiere/forums/forum/610548/topic/3360128
(03:18:06) red1: interopen: how can a functional team use it right away?
(03:18:18) trifon: interopen: what are the issues? are they listed in the wiki?
(03:18:21) red1: what is your advice as the ISEC team is mainly Oracle ppl also?
(03:18:32) interopen: we find Sahi quite flexible to adapt, so we are going to consider them when there are more tests done
(03:18:50) red1: they usually handle functional and did alot of testing already although manually which will be avoided in future
(03:19:03) interopen: red1: better they wait for the CI testing server
(03:19:13) red1: when will that be up?
(03:19:28) interopen: Trifon: yes they are documented in the wiki and the solution, but not a final one we think
(03:19:31) red1: what materials can we put in or assist?
(03:19:48) red1: i was thinking if Fitnesse, we can write use cases
(03:19:57) red1: or JUnit
(03:20:28) interopen: red1: we hope to have it up next week...
(03:21:04) red1: i think item 13 is where ISEC can prepare for
(03:21:15) red1: they already have test steps in their QA doc
(03:21:35) interopen: red1: both fitnesse and junit are ok, but for different userbase, yes item 13 is where we want the involvement of all
(03:21:39) red1: its a matter of translating them to apply to whatever mechanism u provide from the example
(03:22:08) red1: so the tests are interchangeable? We can have those different tests working in concert?
(03:22:30) interopen: is the idea, we have complete the research, poc, we are building the base server and simple documentation so is easy to create tests for all from developer to end user
(03:22:46) red1: wonderful!
(03:23:23) red1: so is there any advice u can give us in preparing test scripts?
(03:23:27) interopen: we are working with the base that test can be created anywhere and deploy anywhere, but starting...
(03:23:29) red1: or a link perhaps
(03:24:06) interopen: yes, all is in this page http://www.adempiere.com/index.php/PMC:QA and links there also
(03:24:09) red1: will creating more gardenworld sample be useful? Can ISEC team take on that?
(03:24:31) Nithiyada: sure
(03:24:39) interopen: yes, we need to base the community tests on gardenworld sample data
(03:25:07) red1: Nithiyada: as u know the GardenWorld data is useful but still lacking in some places
(03:25:14) interopen: so creating test cases now is a good exercise, so later it can be applied to any of the three tools, depend on what you want to test
(03:25:32) red1: i am sure your team must have created own data and we can make this data back to the project
(03:25:45) red1: using Log Migration checkbox (will guide thru i-zugizo )
(03:26:04) Nithiyada: sure, we can simulate business case and test in each feature
(03:26:59) interopen: Carlos: about the tracker and forum i see they are related to selenium we talk with Heng Sin in other meetings the problem of selenium that is base on codes that need to be the same in every run
(03:27:21) red1: thanks for the link interopen .. alot for us to catch up :)
(03:27:53) CarlosRuiz: Ivan - solving the naming issue will be for both - selenium and sahi - indeed for any testing tool
(03:28:00) interopen: Carlos: Sahi not have this problem, as it work in other way, but have the problems with numbering that we are solving with menu name and field name
(03:29:00) interopen: Carlos: yes selenium work with codes, sahi with number field order, but also sahi use field name
(03:29:43) interopen: Carlos: We will try to clarify this in the wiki during the week.... i write it down
(03:30:07) CarlosRuiz: sure, the issue I found is that component name is not the same all the time
(03:30:41) CarlosRuiz: for example
(03:30:52) CarlosRuiz: if I open http://www.testadempiere.com/webui
(03:31:35) CarlosRuiz: the "User ID" textbox can be something like "z_ro_g"
(03:31:39) CarlosRuiz: then
(03:31:46) CarlosRuiz: I close the browser and open again the same page
(03:32:01) CarlosRuiz: and the ID of the same text box is now "z_to_g"
(03:32:12) CarlosRuiz: so, you cannot use the name of the textbox as a parameter to fill it
(03:32:21) interopen: review here http://www.adempiere.com/index.php/PMC:QA:Sahi_POC_Sales_order
(03:32:43) interopen: how sahi do it : _setValue(_textbox(0), "SuperUser");
(03:32:59) interopen: not use those codes you tell me as selenium
(03:33:14) CarlosRuiz: I see
(03:33:22) CarlosRuiz: _textbox(0) is using position
(03:33:33) CarlosRuiz: not useful to test a window where you changed position of a field
(03:33:53) CarlosRuiz: for example in LCO I change the position of TaxID on BP window
(03:34:11) CarlosRuiz: but I see others that I don't get totally
(03:34:25) CarlosRuiz: for example _click(_cell("Fertilizer[1]"));
(03:35:24) interopen: that is a select
(03:35:39) red1: so these are just examples?
(03:35:40) interopen: and use names also
(03:35:45) red1: we need to create the other fields?
(03:35:57) red1: or script the values for any field?
(03:36:20) red1: how deep in functionality can we use SAHI for?
(03:36:27) interopen: red1: this are working POC with a POS order
(03:37:03) red1: can it track if the invoice and shipment is done?
(03:39:00) interopen: red1: we have not tested, but i not see the limitation if there is a field to check it
(03:39:27) red1: i see.. so we can then check from DocStatus?
(03:39:44) red1: if its Complete and not Invalid or In Progress
(03:40:07) red1: ok, for the JUnit writing, we can proceed writing then?
(03:40:23) red1: and sample GW data also
(03:41:57) interopen: yes, junit test are already in AD code and we just import them in CI server to run http://www.adempiere.com/index.php/PMC:QA:Add_Junit_test_to_Hudson
(03:43:29) interopen: carlos: Sahi works with position, so if change the position the test change and will be invalid
(03:43:47) red1: Nithiyada: does ISEC team like to take the lead on QA or Issue?
(03:43:57) red1: there are vacancies it seems
(03:44:11) Nithiyada: OK
(03:44:29) red1: http://www.adempiere.com/index.php/PMC:QA#Key_Roles
(03:44:55) red1: i think Issue is more suitable isn't it for functional. Am i rite to say that interopen ?
(03:45:00) interopen: Carlos: so there are several solutions for it we are thinking and working on
(03:47:00) interopen: Issue is bug management and for now is manage by the triage
(03:48:15) interopen: red1: bug management should not be the focus of functional, but yes others as features requests,etc...
(03:48:30) red1: basing on Hudson server testing by Metas before.. it merely gives a static test and highlight the error for our action.. can your setup be more of a functional one? and we can then act to revert etc?
(03:49:07) interopen: red1: is the idea we have discuss before, revert, notify developers,etc...
(03:49:22) red1: indeed.. i think QA is the source of Features requests also..
(03:49:41) red1: to allow SI teams identify what works or not
(03:51:52) satyag: red1, naa QA need not be source for features , since they will be overwhelmed by testing based on the specs
(03:52:34) red1: noted
(03:52:58) red1: i mean QA is the first place expert groups look at to match their reqs or specs they expected
(03:53:07) red1: in a technical sense
(03:53:07) satyag: correct
(03:53:19) red1: or perhaps benchmarking is a better word
(03:53:38) satyag: no its not ;-)
(03:53:51) red1: coyly noted
(03:54:10) red1: standards and compliance?
(03:55:18) satyag: again these are top level words it can depend on the context lets say does Ad confrom to certain standard then yes QA can have a plan to Qualify Ad to that
(03:55:47) satyag: Qualify == Compliance
(03:56:38) interopen: Red1: we have in the plan load testing, security testing,etc... but first is functional testing
(03:56:42) satyag: red1, have you seen those kind of standards in ERP world
(03:56:59) satyag: yes security has certain standards which needs to be tested again
(03:57:08) satyag: by QA team
(03:57:08) red1: satyag: i have read bout them.. CAAS, UK etc
(03:57:51) satyag: interopen, agreed functional comes first
(03:58:54) red1: shall we conclude? 1 hour is up
(03:59:18) satyag: was checkin on http://watir.com/ , heard good things about it too
(03:59:18) interopen: all: i see a lot of people today here, anyone want to join QA team, there is a lot and interesting things to do?
(03:59:54) red1: yes, like i said, the ISEC team from Thailand is more of a implementation team with Oracle functional experience
(04:00:06) red1: with a java outsource team they engaging there
(04:00:27) red1: i see JUnit and QA test plans with scripts is what they prefer
(04:00:47) interopen: that is good, as it can bring a lot of comparision on the tests
(04:01:04) trifon: adempeire is alwyas open for junit test. just commti them in extend project in svn.
(04:01:15) red1: the concept of community is also something that is tried out here as Thailand is a huge market on its own and networking will be a journey
(04:01:57) red1: they use VAT and require alot of Oracle style controls
(04:02:04) red1: they can focus on those part for QA
(04:02:24) red1: besides remote replication and POS + Promotion system
(04:02:45) red1: not much vertical development as of yet this year
(04:02:49) CarlosRuiz: ok guys - gtg - thanks a lot for attending the meeting
(04:02:49) CarlosRuiz: Thanks Ivan for leading this group and meetings
(04:02:58) interopen: In QA group there are two parts: 1. research and implement the base QA systems 2. Create tests base on them
(04:03:05) satyag: CarlosRuiz, thanks for your time
(04:03:21) red1: perhaps in next year they go after their big deals.. now is testing stage
(04:03:46) red1: hope that gives u a better picture interopen .. do drop me an email if anyone needs more exchange to clarify matters
(04:03:49) interopen: Carlos: Thanks, we see more in next meeting, i give a rethink to your comments and try to document what i find
(04:03:59) red1: gnite /morning CarlosRuiz
(04:04:10) CarlosRuiz: thanks - bye everybody
(04:04:40) red1: interopen: i didnt really kept track of your work .. but i noticed sunny's alot.. and now i see it is so big.. kudos!
(04:05:08) red1: bye ISEC team .. can u make it tomorrow for the Usability meeting? its later evening :P
(04:05:15) interopen: red1: we are a team also...
(04:05:40) red1: and i been harping on China (my ancestral home) and what a nice surprise this is!
(04:05:50) red1: xie xie nin!
(04:06:18) interopen: xie xie red1 for your comments and help
(04:07:11) red1: thanks Nithiyada Nui Chakj for your first time .. hope u all enjoyed it
(04:07:30) Nui: Sure :-)
(04:07:35) Chakj: very greatfull
(04:07:40) red1: see u again tomorrow evening.. i am almost nailing the Inventory reverse void bug!
